The “Tripod Police” Take Things Up a Notch (You’re not going to believe this one!)
Just when you think the intense fear of tripod’s has gone as far as it can go, this happens: Matt, RC, and I went for an early morning shoot at Grand Central Station yesterday, and each of us carried that most-hated of photographic accessory; the dreaded tripod. We had a special shooting permit to use tripods in the station (more on this later this week), but it was what happened after the shoot that took things to a new level.
After the shoot, we came back to our hotel, the Marriott Marquis in Times Square, to put up our gear so I could head over to B&H Photo for my class at 10:00 am. As we headed into the elevator to go up to our rooms, a uniformed security guard came rushing over and stopped us. He wanted to know where we were going, because after all, we were carrying (wait for it….wait for it) TRIPODS! I shook my head in disbelief and said, “We’re going to our rooms.”
I reached into my pocket to take out my room key to prove we were hotel guests, but I guess we had that really annoyed look that only real hotel guests get when they’re denied access to their rooms, because he said, “Oh, OK” and let us go.
The elevator doors closed, and we’re just standing there looking at each other dumbfounded.
Now, believe me, because this is New York, I understand and respect the need for vigilant security, but was there a tri-pod related terrorist attack that I’m not aware of, that has created this “they’ve got a tripod—they must be up to no good” air that surrounds the city?
Seriously, how have tripods gone from simple stands that hold your camera steady, to terrorist-related devices that raise suspicion and get you stopped by hotel security while simply returning to your room? And we weren’t carrying huge industrial tripods; I had my tiny Gitzo traveler. It’s not as big as an umbrella, yet it draws security like I’m hoisting a grenade launcher.
Is there anything we can do, or is this just the way it’s going to be? Arrrrggghhhh!
Scott and Alex could be right.
Maybe America is just a bad place to live with really bad people.
Scott are you moving to Canada with Alex?
Scott,
Don’t feel too badly, Brother. I work in Two Penn Plaza right above Madison Square Garden and Penn Station. Last spring I was shooting a picture of a pigeon and her baby, which were on top of a bank’s sign. One of the security guys I walk past several times a day came out and asked me what I was shooting. I told him I was taking pictures of a pigeon and he told me that photography was not allowed there without permission.
Interestingly, there are tourists shooting pictures of Madison Square Garden and Penn Station all the time and none of them seem to have a problem. I was shooting hand-held, and had a camera bag. I was using a medium zoom lens–maybe I should have had a point-and-shoot.
I guess this is what has to pass for freedom these days. As Americans we can’t have true freedom and the ability to sue someone else every time we get hurt.
Sorry you had a problem. Thanks for saying so. If no one does that any hope of change is lost.
Blah…. i am traveling to Denver this weekend.. wondering if i should just leave my tripod behind. sigh.
@Jim Brown:
Don’t let Alex get you worked up. He’s just another jealous Canadian full of misinformation fed to our gullible northern neighbors by kooks like Michael Moore.
There’s plenty of crime in Canada, but it mostly goes unreported. In over 60 years of living in the US, I have never been the victim of a serious crime. In my first month of living in Canada, my home was invaded while my wife and I were sleeping. Two weeks later I moved back to the USA where it’s safe.
The myth that we sell automatic weapons in the U.S. is widely believed by the left wingers. Of course, it’s simply not true.
Don’t give the Canadian point of view a second thought. It’s just another third world country with cheap labor that we can exploit to our advantage.
This is what we get when our blustering chicken-hawk leaders ask the population to inform on each other. There have been numerous events like this in Seattle where photographers have been hauled off to jail for taking pictures. Many of the above posters have said “get over it’ or “this the price for keeping us safe”. No, this is the first step to a totalitarian state. Get used to that!
Actually you don´t even need a tripod to be “harassed” at Grand Central Station in NYC. I was taking a couple of photos of a friend and my family against a neutral background, seconds later I was asked by security not to use my camera. It´s really sad to see this happening to people who love to take photos,
I am just glad this had nothing to do with the real police. I can honestly say that in 12 years of being a police officer, neither I or anyone I work with, has ever given anyone trouble for having a tripod.
Jeez, why does everyone start frothing about tripods and terrorism?
The reasons for permits/restrictions in NYC with respect to tripod use are not terrorism-based. Zero, nada….
Alex Campagna wrote:
“- We can leave our doors unlocked at night (haven’t you seen “Bowling for columbine†by Michael Moore ?).
- We don’t sell automatic rifles/handguns at a regular retail store.
- We don’t have these school/university shootouts every year ( the last one was like 25 years ago).
- We can count on our hand the number of homicides in the last year.
- We don’t have terrorists ramming our skyscrapers with Jets.
- We can shoot with a tripod in town almost anywhere and without a permit (I’ve never been bothered by security, even with police passing by me)
- We don’t sue each other for ridiculous reasons and we don’t make TV ads like “It’s YOUR money! Use it when YOU need it†from JG Wentworth.â€
According to Canada’s National Statistical Agency, there were 605 Homicides in Canada for 2006 — Only Yukon Territory, Northwest Territories and Nunavut had number that can be counted on one hand. Perhaps you have a hand with hundred fingers for the rest of the territories.
There was a school shooting in 2006 and 2007 in Canada as well as in 89, 92 & 99 and several in 75
Information was given to me thanks to my friends who live in Canada — they have a few words about the perfect healthcare system there as well, but that is for another day and a different blog
Alex Campagna wrote:
“- We can leave our doors unlocked at night (haven’t you seen “Bowling for columbine†by Michael Moore ?).
Um, yeah that is one of the most laughable moments in the film. Living just across the border from Windsor I can tell you that people lock their doors there too. In fact I could take you to some parts of Windsor that you wouldn’t want to walk around at night any more than Brush Park or Boston Edison in Detroit.
Come on Scott. Please remember we are so use to seeing tripods because we are in the business it’s second nature to us.
Did you think that just maybe:
a) He asked you where you were going not becuase you had tripods but becuase it’s his J.O.B. and he was simply doing it and checking.
b) Sniper Rifles are generally rested on tripods, not like in the movies. Have any idea how many VIP’s travel thru New York Streets?
As one of the above commets read, Get over it. Was it really that important?
Tom
Scott… you should join NAPP… they give you a spiffy membership card that you can flash to the security guys. We’d be honored to have you as a member.
Maybe it is because I live in Indonesia where just about anything goes, but I am really surprised to hear that tripods cause such concern…
People keep mentioning permits…where do you get a permit? The local police station? Is there some kind of NY Tripod Law Enforcement Group that you must see? Where would a tourists traveling to NY get a permit to use a tripod?
Cheers,
Scotty
Hey Scott… Don’t even start… I know very well what you are talking about.
Once I was hired to shoot a graduation, and you can not even imagine the complications that I had just because I had my tri-pod with me.
Anyway… This week I was playing with some pictues that I took of a T-ball game and If any of your readers want to check this cool Video Show that just posted in my blog.. here is the address:
http://paulopics.com/blog/2008/05/07/baseball-t-ball-video-show/
Thanks
Paulo Jordao
I think this sort of eventuality was covered in a recent Homeland Security announcement. I can’t remember the exact wording of the announcement, but I’m certain this is pretty close:
“OOGA BOOGA! OOGA BOOGA! BE SCARED! OOGA BOOGA!”
Hi,
In this case could it not be that the security guard mistook you for photographers of that give all aspects of photography a bad rap? The Pavarotti… (insert sound effect here; like dun,dun,duuunnn.)
Maybe he saw some guys with pro-like gear walking into his turf and was just thinking of the privacy of the other hotel guest?
Just a thought, we should not be too quick to assume that all people are tripod-haters.
Cheers
I thought this situation is valid only in middle eastern countries !!
I’m from Maldives. Maldives has been awarded the best tourist destination in the world several times and yes one of the most photographed countries in the world. I personally use to run around with my full gear on shoots with tripod. I never ever had a problem. There are like 1099 islands in Maldives, you can go to any of the islands and shoot with tripod, no one will bother you.
The most secure buildings in Maldives will be the Presidential Palace and the Police HQ. Those are key tourist spots, there are guards, security cameras 24/7, they never stop anyone from shooting, let it be a local or a tourist.
Still i have to agree that there are times that things go ugly here too but thats only due to disobedience. I saw one guys D2x being smashed to the ground for disobeying order during some police investigation. But thats a different case, no problems with tripods!
I would also agree with Tom, we use tripods and camera’s everyday and they are like part of us but others might not be too familiar with all the gear used.
Just had a funny idea about tripods after reading about your experience. What if they were available in a white finish or some non-threatening colors like pink or light blue? How about putting Teddy Bears or Flowers on them. Yes, I know it would draw a lot of attention, just not from the security folks.
J. Paul
Wanna carry a tripod? Also carry a gun. The tripod won’t get a second glance.
Problem solved.
Scott – I blame your troubles on that black Zildjian T shirt that you like to wear. The font looks…well…foreign…and kind of scary. Also all security persons are well aware of the havoc a drummer can cause in a confined area.
I would suggest that you immediately switch to one of those fake tuxedo T shirts accented with a keyboard tie. Then the security folks will leave you alone although the rest of us might give you a poke.
Living in North Dakota where we carry guns in our back windows, tripods are the last thing people look at.
I have only been stopped once and was took aside into another room at Las Vegas Airport. Hauled off by two guards. That was fun!
Scott,
I share your frustration. I’m always looking over my shoulder when I’m out and about shooting anywhere urban these days. There are far too many photographers being hassled & threatened. Thanks for bringing attention to this issue.
Yes, Dawson college. I totally forgot about this one. My mistake i’m sorry.
When I said you could count homicides on a hand it was more like a comparison to the US homicides.
Just have a look at this link:
http://www.statemaster.com/graph/cri_hom_tot_num_of_vic-crime-homicide-total-number-victims
15029 total USA homicides in 2002 only. Do you get the point now ? 605/year in canada (according to a post above), about 15000/year in usa. That’s what I meant by count on my hand.
I did not say USA is a bad place to live! I simply said that here, it’s safer and it starts with the way you choose to behave. Yes, there are criminals here too, yes there are school shootings (Dawson, polytechnic etc.), but there are simply LESS.
I am not jealous about anyone, and there isn’t anyone that could convince me to go live the rest my life to the united states. That said, I have a lot of friends that live in the US, i go there sometimes and I have a lot of fun, there are a lot of nice places that I WILL visit soon, but I can tell you that way people behave is totally different from here. Especially when it comes to security guards and police.
I sympathize deeply for immigrants living in the united states. Especially those from middle-east. They must have a HELL of a hard time living normally these days……
Hope this settles any confusion.
i once heard that tripods also hold rifles steady for a direct shot.
@ Alex. Maybe there is simply less of everything because there are simply less people living in Canada. 33,390,141 compared to 301,139,947.
NYC population is 8,250,567, almost 25% of the entire Canadian population living on one small island.
Sorry, but your whole Canadian holier than thou approach is wearing thin with me.
Haha I kinda knew that the “population” argument would come
Anyway, the problem isn’t just the security, it’s WHY would would need such security. You will tell me “to prevent disasters like 9/11 or columbine etc”.
I completely agree.
But why would people want to ram jets in building and kill hundreds of innocents? I cannot answer that question nor think of any reason. But there must be a reason right? Why all this anti-americanism?
Why not use all these resources and focus on that mysterious “reason” instead on focusing on photographers with tripods. It’s a good thing to want to prevent a disaster, but I think it’s better to prevent people from wanting such a disaster to happen.
Land of the free, home of the brave?
If you really want to create a stir with your photo gear, try these Nikon holsters:
http://www.skytoptrading.com/hofornidisl.html
Hi Folk:
Just a reminder; this was a post about tripods; not crime in the US and/or Canada.
We’re all friends here, no matter what country, so let’s move on to something else. Like Camera Bag terrorism.
Thanks for understanding.
-Scott
Sad commentary about the paranoia that permeates our daily lives. However, look on the bright side of things. If you do get hauled to court, you’ll have three…not just one…legs to stand on!
I also was a victim of “Tripod Takedown” here in New Mexico when I was shooting texture photos of walls at some fashion shops. The security police held me against my will while they got on their radios and called in for backup. They eventually let me go because their ‘corporal’ was a student photograher and new what my equipment was.
RE: Tripod terror alert.
After arriving back in the states from Nam back in 68, and boarding my flight home to NYC froms San Francisco, I too carried my tripod on the plane. Being in Uniform, and America’s feelings about the Vietnam war at that time, the stewardesses were staring at me and my tripod, The Head stewardess approached me and asked, “Did you ask the pilot for permission to bring that weapon onboard?” I replied, “it’s not a weapon, its my tripod. She seemed a little off, and maybe I was snotty about it, you know, like implying she was stupid. But turnaround is fair play. When it was time to eat she asked what “entree” would you like, and I replied, “what’s an entree”. That’s whe she got snotty and said very slowly ” Which meal would like to be served?”: She got me. The point is that in these times, just as back in 68, it doesn’t hurt to ask. It’s good security, and not personal. Just don’t be Snotty about being asked, cuz it may come back to haunt you.
I am constantly hearing from my photography friends in the UK about the constant harrasment that everyone is getting there it makes me not want to go visit, cause what good is it going to a place like London as a photographer if you cant properly take pics…On the flip side, I have my tripod out all the time here in Boston and never have a problem, so you are more that welcome to come up here for a shoot
Guys,
You are all aware that before 9/11 the group came to NYC and shot pictures tripods and all off all the buildings pano style as many different security cameras pointed out. This way they could measure their damage later.
It is really troubling to me that we as photographers feel so entitled and get so worked up over someone asking us not to take a photo or not to use a particular piece of equipment in order to take that photo. True professionals (not necessarily in the sense of just deriving money from an activity variety) tend to accept the fact that they need to go through the extra hassle of securing permits or obtaining permission, in writing, often a good deal of time in advance, whether it be a model or property release, etc. just because those are the rules of the game.
We all need to learn to accept these rules and play by them without having Lou Pinella style erruptions just because someone has the audacity to tell you not to use a tripod or take a picture of them, their property, their children or the property of their employer, whether or not there is any good, valid or logical reason for that request.
I think that we really all need to put this into perspective and start taking ourselves less seriously. The majority of us that get really upset are hobbyists who happen to have made a conscious choice to purchase certain equipment. Our choice, like choosing the red sports car instead of the brown station wagon and wondering why we are always getting pulled over by the police… If we have made the choice of buying the big camera with the big lenses and the big tripods then we should accept the fact this choice is going to attract attention, and at times that attention will draw the unwanted scrutiny of authorities or their agents. And it really isn’t the size or complexity of the gear that makes the photographer anyway. As Bill Fortney is fond of displaying in his workshops, he has made several publishable images with his Nikon point and shoot. We get attached to our gear, but the true skill of a photographer is their vision. The ability to see the image before they ever place camera to eye, not their ability to exercise their credit limits and haul the heft of “serious” gear.
I recently had the pleasure of going on a photo workshop in Tennessee with Matt K and the GAPW. I went a little bit overboard with equipment, which I wasn’t going to put on as checked luggage, so I was carrying a rather large computer bag, a large photo backpack and photovest. All of this and I overslept and was rushing to make my plane at La Guardia. Well I guess that all of this stress attracted the attention of a TSA supervisor and I received extra special attention. Every single piece of equipment I was carrying, every pocket every bag was searched, swabbed and analyzed, right down to each credit card in my wallet.
Now I had several choices in that moment. 1. I could have chosen to bring a lot less gear, most of which I would never have missed. 2. Not overslept and gotten to the airport early and been organized and calm before I got on the TSA line. I also had the choice of bitching at TSA, but I decided in the moment that wouldn’t help. I chose to be polite, helpful, volunteering information on why I had all of this equipment, where I was going and other small talk. For their part TSA was very professional. They did the job they were supposed to do, thoroughly and as quickly as they could, given everything I was carrying and when it was finished, they got me on my way. I had a choice. I chose to understand and cooperate graciously and I think as a result, they were able to do their job faster and I was still able to make my flight with a few minutes to spare.
There are far more important injustices that we could direct our energy towards and generally the people who are collecting Pultizers every year are focused more on illustrating these injustices than griping about how someone wouldn’t let them use the equipment they wanted.
And back to the fact that we have made this choice of equipment that attracts such scrutiny; there are plenty of people who face inconvenience and discrimination on a daily basis far more henious than this. In NYC, most Subway stations are not handicap accessable. Wheelchair bound people don’t have a choice in the matter; either they have to attempt to find much less direct bus routes or much more expensive modes of transportation. African Americans and Latinos often draw unwanted attention for color of their skin. Law abiding citizens get harassed by the simple fact that they are profiled for their race. The list goes on and on, and we are worried that someone asked us about our Gitzos? Seriously.
I think that the best approach to get what you want was suggested by Enzo. Just ask. Just the courteousy and acknowledgement often will be enough to get someone to bend the rules, just a little. But don’t have any expectations, especially if bending those rules could cause the person to be disciplined or fired. They probably need their job more than you need that image anyway.
I think you’re making something out of nothing. If the guard recognized you he wouldn’t have stopped you. Your tripod likely had nothing to do with it.
Can’t get past most hotel security unless they recognize you or you show a room key. I’m not sure there is anything in what you described that would lead me to conclude your tripods were what triggered the question from the guard.
Get over it, Scott! You’ve wasted blog space ranting insignificant petty diatribe that has no merit to this site. You were not denied access to your room and you were not detained for further interrogation. What’s the big deal? The hotel security guard felt it was his duty to act on his suspicions to protect the guests. Kudos to the security guard!
Yimi wrote “Get over it, Scott! You’ve wasted blog space ranting insignificant petty diatribe that has no merit to this site.”
I think you are wrong in that respect Yimi. This is Scott’s personal blog. He is allowed to personally rant and complain about whatever he wants to. He has no obligation to the expectations of his readers on the content of his site. It is topic relative to what Scott’s blog is all about. It isn’t like he is complaining that the hotel carried Diet Pepsi and not Coke. This is a relavent issue to photographers, whether or not we agree with Scott. To his credit, he has given us the forum and the opportunity to voice our opinions about this topic whether or not we agree with him. He could have easily turn comments off on this so we couldn’t reply for or against his point of view.
They probably became suspected terrorist devices about the time Ken Follet wrote “Day of the Jackel” where the device used to assassinate Charles DeGaulle was disguisted as a cripple’s crutch.
Thank you for your blog Scott!
Thinking about buying a good sturdy tripod anyway for my camera.
- It´s good to be prepared for what might happen while using it though. By the way, it would be very interesting to know more about where and how to apply for “tripod/photo permits” for different locations. Some kind of list maybe or a new book? I´m sure that visitors to different locations in the US can save time by beeing prepared.
Sadly, Scott, it has nothing to do with terrorism — sometimes I wish it did.
They’re freaked out about you shooting the “private property” and publishing the photos. Cuz you knoww those damned journalists (of wwhich I’m one) are so sneaky, they might want to take (gasp!) pictures of things that you don’t think they should be ablee to.
I actually had a bank security guard LEAVE his little office, LEAVE the bank, and then walk out onto the public sidewalk, to tell me I couldn’t take pictures of the bank’s driveway. I politely told him to bite me, but he honestly believed he could call the cops and have me removed for not heeding his advice and leaving the PUBLIC sidewalk (which he said the bank owned). Seriously, howw freakin’ stupid are people??
I had this happen to a friend. Except the guard got aggressive real quick and tried to take my friends camera cause he wouldn’t stop and delete the pictuers. The commotion got the attention of the real police across the street. They came over, and the guard started complain and demand the police arrest us. However the officer in this case saw the whole thing from the start he told us were just fine as we were. The cop was seconds short from arresting the security guard if the guard didn’t back down immediately.
John V., was your statement that “before 9/11 the group came to NYC and shot pictures tripods and all off all the buildings” intended as satire or an assertion of fact? And if factual, can you provide a link to the evidence?
This is something I haven’t heard before.
Thank you, John.
And thanks, Scott, for your story.
Wouldn’t a terrorist taking pictures to study a target use a small inconspicuous point & shoot camera rather than a big DSLR & tripod that would attract attention?
Why are you putting a gratuitous apostrophe before the ’s’ in the word ‘tripods’? You’re saying that tripods are doing the fearing rather than being feared.
Also in Europe they started considering tripods as mass destruction weapons